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	<title>Comments on: Upgrading Discussion</title>
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	<description>a weblog experiment by Lisa M. Lane, dedicated to the principle of Pedagogy First!</description>
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		<title>By: Lisa</title>
		<link>http://lisahistory.net/wordpress/?p=251&#038;cpage=1#comment-26283</link>
		<dc:creator>Lisa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Sep 2009 17:24:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lisahistory.net/wordpress/?p=251#comment-26283</guid>
		<description>Hi, Paul. The only reason I wouldn&#039;t want to go for Voicethread is that I really need them to write in the forum (rather than speak). This is for two reasons, the most important being that it is the main place, other than the essays on tests, where they do write, since I do not assign major papers. The second reason is that I have 200 students per semester, and read much faster than I could listen to all the responses!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi, Paul. The only reason I wouldn&#8217;t want to go for Voicethread is that I really need them to write in the forum (rather than speak). This is for two reasons, the most important being that it is the main place, other than the essays on tests, where they do write, since I do not assign major papers. The second reason is that I have 200 students per semester, and read much faster than I could listen to all the responses!</p>
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		<title>By: Paul Martenis</title>
		<link>http://lisahistory.net/wordpress/?p=251&#038;cpage=1#comment-26282</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul Martenis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Sep 2009 17:12:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lisahistory.net/wordpress/?p=251#comment-26282</guid>
		<description>Sounds like what you want is VoiceThread (http://voicethread.com).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sounds like what you want is VoiceThread (<a href="http://voicethread.com)." rel="nofollow">http://voicethread.com).</a></p>
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		<title>By: Lisa</title>
		<link>http://lisahistory.net/wordpress/?p=251&#038;cpage=1#comment-21842</link>
		<dc:creator>Lisa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 15:07:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lisahistory.net/wordpress/?p=251#comment-21842</guid>
		<description>@Jim Thanks so much for posting an example of a question you use -- I like the way you have them tie specifically to a concept. In my structure, this would work in the second part of the week.

The (slight) difference between our initial approaches I also find interesting. I have been writing the honors curriculum for History under the new rules, and have been frustrated by the demand to tie course &quot;content&quot; (in our case, usually a chronological list of items) more closely to the &quot;student performance objectives&quot; (which I want to be more skills-based). I would like instructors to be able to choose, even on the spur of the moment, which content they want to use to achieve those objectives. Kind of like my open-ended questions applied to curriculum.

@Frances That is one of those things I&#039;ll leave open the first time I do it, to see what happens. In terms of method, if they bring in just one additional item to prove their point, that would work great, but I want to encourage them to bring the good stuff in up front, then work with what&#039;s there, creating a pattern. I know some students will bring in more during the second part of the discussion, regardless of any instruction, so I&#039;ll leave it open.

@John Although articles have said otherwise, I have not found that lack of easy sociability in a real-world environment relates to online behavior. I think most students who are shy to post online are unsure about what they say. Here, perhaps, those students will find it more comfortable to post an actual item on which they can base their comments. What I want is for them to feel OK about exploring ideas with others.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Jim Thanks so much for posting an example of a question you use &#8212; I like the way you have them tie specifically to a concept. In my structure, this would work in the second part of the week.</p>
<p>The (slight) difference between our initial approaches I also find interesting. I have been writing the honors curriculum for History under the new rules, and have been frustrated by the demand to tie course &#8220;content&#8221; (in our case, usually a chronological list of items) more closely to the &#8220;student performance objectives&#8221; (which I want to be more skills-based). I would like instructors to be able to choose, even on the spur of the moment, which content they want to use to achieve those objectives. Kind of like my open-ended questions applied to curriculum.</p>
<p>@Frances That is one of those things I&#8217;ll leave open the first time I do it, to see what happens. In terms of method, if they bring in just one additional item to prove their point, that would work great, but I want to encourage them to bring the good stuff in up front, then work with what&#8217;s there, creating a pattern. I know some students will bring in more during the second part of the discussion, regardless of any instruction, so I&#8217;ll leave it open.</p>
<p>@John Although articles have said otherwise, I have not found that lack of easy sociability in a real-world environment relates to online behavior. I think most students who are shy to post online are unsure about what they say. Here, perhaps, those students will find it more comfortable to post an actual item on which they can base their comments. What I want is for them to feel OK about exploring ideas with others.</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Sullivan</title>
		<link>http://lisahistory.net/wordpress/?p=251&#038;cpage=1#comment-21839</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Sullivan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 14:08:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lisahistory.net/wordpress/?p=251#comment-21839</guid>
		<description>I have been thinking about these same issues, Lisa, in both onsite and online settings. And I think the mixing of options is a good tool. In my hybrid class this semester, I found that when students were asked to post and comment upon images, videos, or sound that they constructed very interesting posts. I still provide a bit more structure than you do (mostly because I do not think I have your gift for the truly open question--but I am working on it!)--and one particular structure I have been having some success with is the application question: 

&quot;Find an image, video, our sound clip on the web and apply Jack Solomon&#039;s ideas about competitive elitism in America to what you find: What would Solomon say about the example you have found. Make sure you wrap up your post with some evaluation: do you agree with what you have posited as Solomon&#039;s analysis or not?&quot;

Of course, this can be opened up in lots of ways, but the idea of finding something out there and then applying and evaluating something the student has read has been working for me...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have been thinking about these same issues, Lisa, in both onsite and online settings. And I think the mixing of options is a good tool. In my hybrid class this semester, I found that when students were asked to post and comment upon images, videos, or sound that they constructed very interesting posts. I still provide a bit more structure than you do (mostly because I do not think I have your gift for the truly open question&#8211;but I am working on it!)&#8211;and one particular structure I have been having some success with is the application question: </p>
<p>&#8220;Find an image, video, our sound clip on the web and apply Jack Solomon&#8217;s ideas about competitive elitism in America to what you find: What would Solomon say about the example you have found. Make sure you wrap up your post with some evaluation: do you agree with what you have posited as Solomon&#8217;s analysis or not?&#8221;</p>
<p>Of course, this can be opened up in lots of ways, but the idea of finding something out there and then applying and evaluating something the student has read has been working for me&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Sui Fai John Mak</title>
		<link>http://lisahistory.net/wordpress/?p=251&#038;cpage=1#comment-21838</link>
		<dc:creator>Sui Fai John Mak</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 07:38:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lisahistory.net/wordpress/?p=251#comment-21838</guid>
		<description>Thanks Lisa for this sharing.  I could now understand your concern about the discussion issue, their lack of skills in the Moodle Forum, and their lack of in-depth analysis and critical thinking in their learning.  

So there is a need of new design to approach the problem.  

I like your approach, in that you intend to empower them to put more efforts into learning and reflect more regularly in order to improve their learning.  

Designing for openness sounds good.  What about your students&#039; readiness of openness?  

My first few encounters with fellow colleagues (in staff development courses) and students &quot;on-line&quot; were not easy.  I would say most people were faily &quot;closed&quot; - not much interaction or openness, especially if people don&#039;t see the needs.  

Sometimes, it may be &quot;good&quot; to learn from such &quot;mistakes&quot;.  Learning styles DO exist.

As some people are introverts, how would you cater for their needs in such environment.

You might also have found such scenarios from CCK08, where one could find no comments for nearly all posts, or some are just lurkers....without much sign of openness.  

So, that would be interesting to learn how to design and apply &quot;openness&quot; in practice.  
John</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Lisa for this sharing.  I could now understand your concern about the discussion issue, their lack of skills in the Moodle Forum, and their lack of in-depth analysis and critical thinking in their learning.  </p>
<p>So there is a need of new design to approach the problem.  </p>
<p>I like your approach, in that you intend to empower them to put more efforts into learning and reflect more regularly in order to improve their learning.  </p>
<p>Designing for openness sounds good.  What about your students&#8217; readiness of openness?  </p>
<p>My first few encounters with fellow colleagues (in staff development courses) and students &#8220;on-line&#8221; were not easy.  I would say most people were faily &#8220;closed&#8221; &#8211; not much interaction or openness, especially if people don&#8217;t see the needs.  </p>
<p>Sometimes, it may be &#8220;good&#8221; to learn from such &#8220;mistakes&#8221;.  Learning styles DO exist.</p>
<p>As some people are introverts, how would you cater for their needs in such environment.</p>
<p>You might also have found such scenarios from CCK08, where one could find no comments for nearly all posts, or some are just lurkers&#8230;.without much sign of openness.  </p>
<p>So, that would be interesting to learn how to design and apply &#8220;openness&#8221; in practice.<br />
John</p>
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		<title>By: Frances Bell</title>
		<link>http://lisahistory.net/wordpress/?p=251&#038;cpage=1#comment-21837</link>
		<dc:creator>Frances Bell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 06:34:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lisahistory.net/wordpress/?p=251#comment-21837</guid>
		<description>I really like that idea Lisa: it intrigues me that in one space, you will see different themes drawing on a set of objects, overlapping and showing how evidence is interpreted differently.
Will they be allowed to introduce new objects at the point they are docuemnting their theme?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I really like that idea Lisa: it intrigues me that in one space, you will see different themes drawing on a set of objects, overlapping and showing how evidence is interpreted differently.<br />
Will they be allowed to introduce new objects at the point they are docuemnting their theme?</p>
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